Hit And Run

[Fred Steeves]

Hi everybody, I suppose after the whole deal on the GFL thread yesterday I should try to explain to ya'll the reasons behind my posting manner at times, whether right, wrong, or somewhere in the fuzzy middle. I'll admit I was a bit pissed off for starters at how Lord Sidious(Rob) was being talked about, especially if some have never even communicated with him or know him, and I consider him a friend. I'm not a particularly brave man, but I do stand up for friends when it appears they are getting a raw deal. This of course includes the couple of other times I've spoken up here like that.

So then, it's not that I don't relish good conversations, even healthy debates as should be evident by my nearly 1,400 posts at Avalon during the year I was there. What I DON'T like is making them personal, whether just perceived as so or not. At the same time I've done the whole heated exchange thing, both in real life and in a forum, and it never leads anywhere positive. Especially in the public eye where egos on both sides can rapidly come into play.

I'll admit that by yesterday evening I was not a very happy camper, and anything I would have posted would not have been helpful, so I invited Reaver to a 1 on 1 chat for a little back channel dialogue to see if we might just be able to find us a little common ground. I don't know that we came to many areas of agreement, but that doesn't really even matter. We were able to talk for a while with increasing mutual respect I believe, and hopefully atleast understand where the other was coming from better. I think so. What do you think Reaver?

There are other factors as well that we discussed, but rather than me just keep rambling on about myself which I'm loathe to do, maybe they will come up for discussion here in this thread along with everyone else's. Like me and Reaver, agreement is not necessary, just like me and Chico will never agree on some matters, but perhaps we can come to some greater general understandings of where we are all coming from atleast. I would like that, I think ya'll likely would too.

Geez, I hope this makes sense LOL. So here goes, now posting.:smile:

Cheers,
Fred

[Richard]

I'll admit that by yesterday evening I was not a very happy camper, and anything I would have posted would not have been helpful, so I invited Reaver to a 1 on 1 chat for a little back channel dialogue to see if we might just be able to find us a little common ground

That my friend is why I have always felt a chatroom is an essential part of a well functioning forum, it allows for realtime conversations where misunderstandings and perspectives can be worked on and corrected. Forums are great for information sharing but is not as intimate if you will, and leaves a lot open to (mis)interpretation.

[flower]

Fred, thank you for the thread and showing your heart.

So much good comes from ...communicating with each other.

Many rumors fly...and people believe them

I have heard thru the grapevine that Lord Sidious doesnt like me , thinks i am stupid.

Now this isnt the first rumor i have heard...but it does have its effect.

I wonder how many rumors about me are out there... how many people have a perception of me that is "tilted" because of innuendo...

1 on 1 contact is essential to truly knowing anyone.

The moment i was told that lord Sidious was complaining to others about my thread... i asked... "Why doesnt he talk to me about it?"

games...games people play..

moi j'en ai asser des jeux ...

[Jenci]

When I saw that title, Fred, I thought oh no, he's going to run.

I'm pleased that my initial thought was wrong and to not only read such a great post but to hear that you and Reaver have come to understand each other better.

Cheers to both Fred and Reaver :yo:

Jeanette

[Dreamwalker]

[

I have heard thru the grapevine that Lord Sidious doesnt like me , thinks i am stupid.

Now this isnt the first rumor i have heard...but it does have its effect.
to judge someone and express that they are stupid,is pretty shallow imo.

[flower]

if its even true manny... that he said that.


who freaking knows anymore....


Anythings possible and nothing is true

[Odah]

Celine. i do remember when the chat was bustlling and someone would would pop in ..and apperently have pre conceived notions of how you where..based of what ever heresay they had of you ..and goad you into a response that proved their view of you to themselves.. iit was sortof a daily thing.

It's yer name gotta be ..First online friend i had Was name Ceylynn or had no trouble finding trouble ..

[reaver]

What do you think Reaver?

Aye, as I said in one of my posts yesterday, I was trying to get some contrast... not agreements, but understanding. Thing is, sometimes things can go downhill if there is not a clear picture, a background of sorts. You know, the last thing I want to get is full agreement with everybody, I can't get much contrast that way. I've been trying to establish a series of mirrors lately, little pyschedelic/psychological abstract artifacts. That and I'm one to focus in particular and general pictures.

While we are at these crossroads, Gurdjieff's concept of mentation pops up in my head: http://www.philosophia.bem-vindo.net/modules/glossary/entry.php?entryID=165

Don't agree with the idea about heated discussions leading nowhere tough. As I told you yesterday, I've seen quite a few heated discussions here on the forum, personal attacks and still, in the middle of the conceptual crap, excellent insights surface. I see this thread as an example to be honest, gold appearing from the heap of crap, so to speak.

Now there is another point to consider, exchanges in forums can be quite impersonal... so much can be lost because there is no direct contact, I'm talking about physical space here, while chat rooms may reduce those barriers, they still can't cut it 100%. Often times being able to see the other person face to face makes a huge difference, the tone of the ideas being expressed is that much more clear.

Anyways, I appreciate the fact that you went on to clarify your position, Fred.

[Odah]

reaver.. the interesting thing about the difference between face to face discussion and forums ..is that with forums people have the option to read over what they say..and tone it down before hitting enter..or even editing the mean stuff later on to tone down a fight..

Instead though once they hit enter and post they generally stick to what they had written with an deep unwillingness to back off..where as face to face if you get harsh and cool off.. you tend to try and keep it civil..or even try to deny it got as harsh as it did..and general both people will back off or figure it is best to stay away ..

online people can be mean to each other daily for months ..and get real real visious.. the problem is today a lot of people will fight there battles online when they have the option of working things out face to face.

[Chicodoodoo]

Like me and Reaver, agreement is not necessary, just like me and Chico will never agree on some matters

Never say never! Life is full of surprises, full of misunderstandings, full of illusions, full of misconceptions, and full of revelations and realizations. Our disagreements are like stepping stones that lead to a common destination. Without them, we go nowhere.

[Fred Steeves]

Never say never! Life is full of surprises, full of misunderstandings, full of illusions, full of misconceptions, and full of revelations and realizations. Our disagreements are like stepping stones that lead to a common destination. Without them, we go nowhere.

Well ain't that for sure Chico. I know I understood you much better after a chat, when before I was pretty much under the assumption that you were kind of a jackass. I reckon that perception was mutual. LOL. Celine is dead right in how important just basic communication is.

I think road rage says a lot about the psychology of our interactions with others. It's oh so easy to blow a gasket at someone on the road, but at that point I think we tend to see them more as like an avatar, the car, rather than another human being who lives, laughs and cries just like us. Isn't it funny how quickly the perception can change if we happen to pull up next to them at a stop light?

I think forums are very similar to this. When we just see someone's occassional posts that we generally tend to disagree with, it's easy to dismiss their humanity, even though we're usually unaware of it. Once we talk personally to that person it changes everything. The heck with chatrooms, or even a phone conversation. What if we found ourselves somehow in their home, meeting a wife, husband, kids, dogs, etc.?

I'd be willing to bet if I met anyone here personally, we split a 12 pack and just shot the sh!t, it would be mighty difficult for either one of us to show even the slightest disrespect on the forum again. Sure we could still have even strong disagreements that may likely never be reconciled, but something is different now.

Tell ya what. Next time someone here is in the Tampa area let me know, I'll spring for the beer.:cheers:

Cheers,
Fred

[Odah]

if you people thought the same way i did..there would be no reason for me to visit

[Charles]

Rofl a 2 hour ride for free beer and conversation? Im there!

[Fred Steeves]

Rofl a 2 hour ride for free beer and conversation? Im there!

Hey Charles, I built just the place for it in my back yard, we call it "The Palm Tree Pub".

3057

[Charles]

Hey Charles, I built just the place for it in my back yard, we call it "The Palm Tree Pub".

Looks great! I just might have to visit even if just to hang out in the pub!

[flower]

When we just see someone's occassional posts that we generally tend to disagree with, it's easy to dismiss their humanity,

Hear Hear !!!

[Northern Boy]

Beer beer :alcoholic: